(Public Lecture, Brisbane 5th May, 1987)
Shri Mataji: In the beginning they do little bit. Is still they are not settled down. You see they have to mature in Sahaja Yoga no doubt. But in the beginning they do little bit differ but not much. In the beginning they do little bit sometimes differ, that I have seen because one has to mature first of all. Once they are matured they don’t. They are very much in union with each other. There’s no difference at all.
Question: God and Spirit.. Is God reflected within us? How can man be one with God?
Shri Mataji: God and Spirit. Is correct. That’s correct. Very correct. God Almighty is reflected in your heart as Spirit. But without this connection you cannot feel that Spirit. Because I have not talked about the Spirit that’s why you must be thinking, but at the very outset, I said “You have to be the Spirit, first thing.” And, secondly I have also said that you have to feel this all-pervading Power. So, this connection when it is established, then only you start feeling your Spirit. And, the Spirit manifests through you. Is correct, what you said is absolutely correct. God is within you.
Quetion: So how do we go about experiencing this?
Shri Mataji: That’s what we are going to do, but if that is the point then I’m very happy, because you are a real seeker, I must say.
Interviewer: I did read in the Press Communiqué that one of your topics is the topic of Guru, of gurus. Gurus, false gurus. Now what are they? How do you discriminate a false guru and a genuine Guru?
Shri Mataji: Yes, I’ve been talking against them since I think, 1970 very openly, even naming them. It’s very easy to make them out, you see, they are out for money. It’s the shopping. And they are out for money. They know the need of the hour. It’s like the demand and supply business, you see. It’s an economic activity. And, anybody who asks for money, one must know it’s not real.
Now, for example, your Realization is a living process. And we don’t pay any money to the Mother Earth to sprout the seed. Of course, but say, supposing, these people have started this Ashram. Now, here there are so many living. I don’t know how they spend, how they live, it is their lookout. They know all accounts, everything, I don’t bother. I am very bad at money myself. And also, you see they are the ones who collect money, and put up the posters and things like that. But for Realization I cannot take money, for curing you I cannot take money. I mean, there’s no question, you cannot value it. This has no economic value.
Interviewer: So you would say the discrimination is if somebody is interested in money – or not?
Shri Mataji: First. First chance. Second you must see the life style of such a person. Supposing such a man leads a very funny life, immoral life. And tells you big stories, then you should know that this is wrong, because a person who himself is not pure has no business to make others pure. There are many things described about false gurus in our scriptures, thank God. And so if you see their behaviour, that they say something and do something else. And they have scandalous life behind it. But the disciples just hide it, because they think, now we have jumped in the sea so let us have it. They just go through it. They are exposed, so many of them are so badly exposed, but still their disciples find it difficult to get out, because they are under their control, their spell. They know that this man is wrong. He has done so much wrong. Like Rajneesh, now see, he has been found out. There are so many Germans who go to him, in Poona. And about this man I told long time back that he is wrong type of person.
Interviewer: So would you see it as, I mean to come back to the question of the New Age, is one of the signs of New Age that you are travelling around?
Shri Mataji: Nothing, this is the New Age I have started. You see, we had a very great artist from India who came here, he is a shennai player. He is a Muslim gentleman. He said, “These are all [Khalists ?], these are all pure people, Khalists people. So you are making a Khalistan here.” I said, “Yes, this is the Khalistan which Nanaka has described.” So he said, “What are they making?” I said, “You go and ask them what are they making? Where there is war and killing and all that going on, there is no Khalistan. These are Khalists, the pure people. And it’s described in all the prophecies.
In India there was a prophecy done by a very old astrologer. I think, he was the first – he is the pioneer of astrology. And he is the one who said, “Such and such time is going to come, and that Kundalini is going to be awakened, and that people are going to get this blessing, and this will be the New Age, and that people will become realized other people.” Even William Blake has so clearly said. William Blake has said, “God of men,” I mean, His prophecies are to such a detailed thing, that even in London where our Ashram will be he has described. To that extent. So it’s all there.
Q: Excuse me, what is the connection, if any, of Sahaja Yoga and Reiki or are they parallel with one another?
Shri Mataji: I don’t want to criticize anything, only thing you should see, all these things, what have you gained? First question, what have you gained by doing anything? Have you got Self-Realization? Have you got the knowledge of the Divine? Have you felt the cool breeze of the Holy Ghost? Just like that. As a Mother, I would say what did you get out of it? There are so many in the market, so many. I would ask you this question. Child, what did you get? There’s no end to such things.